Would anything cause you to disrobe?
Do you see any benefit to the lay life?
They're kind of two different questions.
Would anything cause me to disrobe?
I have seen circumstances where people were forced to disrobe.
People who had no interest in the lay life were forced to disrobe, generally dealing with their parents.
There's one really impressive man in Thailand who was a monk for 17 years and a very strong meditator.
And by all appearances seems to be
perhaps one of the four enlightened types of beings.
Probably not an arahat, because they say that requires ordination, but certainly a very strong meditator and a very wise individual.
And he collects garbage and sells garbage in Thailand, sells recyclables, which is actually a fairly lucrative trade.
But he just gets on his motorcycle with a sidecar or a trailer or something and he rides around looking for garbage to pick up and to sell or to trade or whatever.
but he had to disrobe because of his mother I can't remember the exact story but his mother was sick and couldn't take care of herself and he was her only son and so he felt he had to disrobe and he lives his life celibate and alone and a very simple life he cooks food for his mother and then goes off to work and comes back in the evening and then they say he eats cold rice
And so he lives quite a noble life.
So what I mean to say is that even in his case where he was obviously someone who was quite advanced, he still felt the need to disrobe.
So I can't say that nothing would cause me to disrobe.
But I think they're two pertinent questions because it points to the fact that you would have to see something
some benefit in the lay life to disrobe people tend to make a mistake about disrobing that it's giving up something that you're giving up the path I suppose it's not a mistake but it's really only one way of looking at the issue because disrobing doesn't just mean taking off the robes I mean if it just means taking off the robes you become a naked ascetic or something or become an animal again
But it means taking off the robes and generally means putting on another set of culturally and role specific clothing.
Because when you put on pants it really does have quite a meaning.
Pants are not the default and the t-shirt or whatever it is that you end up wearing.
Or not the default, in fact, you might think that robes are much more a default clothing, and that's why the Buddha chose them.
So, to become a lay person again, you would have to have, I would think you would have to see some benefit in the lay life.
You would have to think that somehow there was a benefit to lay life.
Do I see any benefit in the lay life?
Besides the benefit that I just mentioned, taking care of your parents, which I'm still skeptical of, because in many cases you can, as a monk, take care of your parents.
You can't do everything for them.
But for myself, I wouldn't probably have such a concern.
I can't say that.
You never know what the future is going to bring.
But there are always ways to, even as a monk, to support your parents.
For example, given that I have a number of students who appreciate what I do and wish for me to continue doing what I do,
I can explain to them, you know, if there is a desire for me to remain a monk, then maybe I can have some people help me to help my parents.
This is an example.
So in my case, it's not that pressing of a concern or not that big of a worry.
And I might someday want to go back to Canada to be closer to them.
Yeah, I'm always thinking of that, but that's, I think, another story.
Obviously, it wouldn't be to disrobe, and I don't have any thought in that direction.
But seeing a benefit, right, besides taking care of your parents, seeing a benefit in the lay life, no.
No, I don't see any benefit in the lay life.
It really speaks of where your mind is.
The point is that personally I don't see a great benefit in, for example, supporting or contributing to society.
Because I think maybe this is something that keeps people as lay people or makes them disrobe.
they want to go and do good things in the world and they feel like as a monk or a nun that they're not able to do that which I think is really or I don't see things in that way so as a result I probably wouldn't follow such a thought
Because from my point of view, the thing that helps people the most is meditation and the practice of the Buddhist teaching.
I mean, even today, just the wonderful things that went on in this ceremony, again and again, it's such a wonderful thing.
to give and to be a part of giving and even not to give, but to rejoice in the giving of others, to watch other people give and be generous and be kind and be helpful.
That's just a wonderful thing.
And it's a wonderful thing that becomes so very powerful in a Buddhist context because it's our spiritual practice.
Of course, it would be the same, I suppose, in a Christian context.
or Jewish context, whatever context, Muslim context, a Hindu context, this giving, of course, given our belief or our view, our opinion that the Buddha's teaching is the purest.
Of course, because it's very much the core of the Buddha's teaching is to do good deeds and to avoid bad deeds.
There's no...
no overhead, there's no extraneous views or opinions or beliefs or practices.
The practice is really to make yourself a better person, to make your mind more pure by giving gifts and by keeping morality.
So this is really our spiritual practice.
And this is the wonderful thing, is that this is people getting together to do this in a spiritual sense.
And you can only really get that in a community like this, or it becomes much more powerful in a community like this, in a monastic community.
And there's no question in my mind that
The benefit of being a monk is the greater benefit to oneself and to others to the whole world Even just as an example even just as someone it's a very powerful thing to be an example to to see someone Doing good things to see someone meditating
When we're sitting around and suddenly we see one of us is meditating, we all remember, oh yes, and it brings us back to our meditation.
But it can really change your life, and of course it's changed many people's lives, just to see other people ordained.
When we go on alms round or when people come to the monastery and see us, they're so happy, and it really changes people.
So I don't see benefit because I'm not really concerned about society or the direction that it's taking or the benefits towards society.
I'm concerned, I suppose, or concerned I'm interested or I don't know how to put it correctly.
I enjoy, I suppose, and appreciate and do as a matter of course, try to help people, help humanity.
But I don't think that has anything to do with the lay life.
I don't think the lay life is anything that benefits people.
Because of course, when you put on the pants, when you put on the shirt, when you go to get a job, you're taking part in many of the things that we see as being the problem.
the consumerism and materialism and just so much uselessness that goes on out there.
Even just our interaction with people who come here, the comparison, what they get from us and what we pick up from them is really two different things.
Two totally different things.
So what we get from them is their greed and their stress and their frustrations and sadness and suffering that they have in their lives and living in the world.
And when you compare it with the peace and the happiness and the simplicity of the life that we lead, it's really not difficult to make a choice.
I would say the biggest reason, the only really powerful reason that leads people to disrobe is sensuality or sexuality, to put it bluntly.
I suppose you could expand that to sensuality.
Some people are just attached to food, for example.
It's funny how silly people can be as wanting this food or wanting that food and knowing that as a monk it's not convenient to get it.
you know, entertainment and so on.
But at the core, I would say sexuality, and it's something that leads people to not be able to ordain.
Now, I've, you know, been down there, that road, and I'm happy to discuss that, the question of sexuality.
It's really a...
That's one of the more wonderful benefits of being a Buddhist monk, is to look objectively at the sexual desire, at the sexual impulse, and to come to break it up, as I've said in other videos, and to see the pieces of it, to see the pleasure, and to finally
Because even as lay people we repress and we feel guilty about our sexual desires, right?
It's something that you have to do in private and something that you have to hide.
But we...
we still, even though we might say a Buddhist monk is someone who's repressing these desires, it's actually the opposite.
You finally have a forum in which you can approach these issues.
You can sit in your kuti and you can not have to feel guilty.
You say, well, I know I'm not going to follow it.
I'm just sitting here and I have this desire and so on.
And so actually it winds up being the opposite.
But finally you have a chance to say, yes, I have this sexual desire, I have this pleasure arising in the body, all these chemical reactions and so on.
Anyway, that's not really what the question was about.
But for myself, I think I've been lucky to have good teachers and
I'm able to
look honestly at the issues that are inside myself.
These issues where you might say, I know it's wrong, but I have to disrobe.
It seems to me that when you really look at them and when you are honest about them, that they cease to become a problem and they simply become another object of meditation.
Good question, and these questions are always interesting, I think, for people, because there's a lot of people out there looking to ordain, or sorry, considering ordination, so interesting to talk about.
And these are also the videos that become very contentious, because half the people say, wonderful, wonderful, I agree completely, and other people who say,
how can you denounce society and lay life?
And the Buddha said that lay people could become enlightened as well, and so on and so on.
So there's nothing wrong with being a lay person, and you can practice meditation, but there's no question that from a Buddhist point of view, the monastic life or the simple meditative life is to be...
You could say, really could say the monastic life is of greater benefit.
So you're giving up something that is of lesser benefit or is of lesser use or is less conducive for the practice of meditation because of course the monastic community has its benefits as well.
Even though lay people can live meditative simple lives, it's very easy for them to get off track and to get lost because of the lack of discipline
and community, which is gained from being a Buddhist monastic.
So those are my thoughts.
Just some thoughts.