WEBVTT 00:21.293 --> 00:24.437 Good evening everyone and welcome to our live broadcast. 00:29.663 --> 00:45.583 Today we're looking at Anguttaranikaya Book of Sixes, Sutta 45, Inna Sutta. 00:45.603 --> 00:46.744 Inna means 00:50.791 --> 00:52.253 I didn't change the title. 00:52.393 --> 00:52.713 Okay. 00:53.474 --> 00:57.199 Ina means debt. 00:59.322 --> 01:00.624 Yeah, it means debt. 01:01.645 --> 01:06.211 So this is the sutta about debt. 01:06.231 --> 01:14.842 But the suttas, I guess you could say it's about debt. 01:15.303 --> 01:16.444 It starts with poverty. 01:19.546 --> 01:22.049 It's talking about a Dalit. 01:22.069 --> 01:28.996 I think they have the word Dalit. 01:29.056 --> 01:30.778 Yeah, they have these people they call Dalit. 01:30.798 --> 01:34.141 A Dalit is a low class person or an outcast person. 01:36.744 --> 01:49.317 In the time of the Buddha, it just meant a poor person, I think, a vagrant, a beggar, the wretched people of the society. 01:51.271 --> 02:00.923 People who live down the streets without any refuge, without any support, without any money, without any wealth. 02:05.468 --> 02:08.091 Dalida. 02:08.111 --> 02:12.817 Dalidiyang bikawe dukhang lokasminga mabhogino di. 02:15.580 --> 02:17.262 It's actually asking a question. 02:21.055 --> 02:45.072 O monks bhikkhus, you who have seen the danger of samsara, for one who partakes of sensuality in this world, is poverty not suffering? 02:51.565 --> 02:56.230 Most people are quite afraid of the loss of their wealth. 02:57.611 --> 03:05.660 We hear stories about misers who fear for the loss of even the smallest amount of money. 03:14.309 --> 03:18.754 We have people who are worried about making ends meet. 03:20.776 --> 03:22.719 and people who are worried about their jobs. 03:24.481 --> 03:40.742 The fear of being impoverished is one that a person must live with in the world, for as long as they are desirous of sensual indulgence. 03:44.097 --> 03:57.218 Because poverty would mean the inability to indulge, it would mean being faced with sensual experiences, seeing, hearing, smelling, tasting, feeling unpleasant sensations. 04:01.665 --> 04:08.856 A homeless person has to experience much that is 04:10.304 --> 04:11.826 fearsome to most people. 04:13.207 --> 04:19.014 Sort of things that most people would never want to experience. 04:19.034 --> 04:20.736 And so the monks say, evangbandhe. 04:22.178 --> 04:27.464 Yes, of course, for a person who's left behind sensuality, being homeless is actually a wonderful thing, right? 04:28.906 --> 04:34.653 Even being penniless is in many ways a wonderful thing for one who has given up sensuality. 04:37.396 --> 04:39.298 No need to concern oneself with money, 04:40.882 --> 04:42.585 If one's hungry, it's just hunger. 04:42.625 --> 04:46.152 If one's thirsty, it's just thirst. 04:46.172 --> 04:49.278 If one's assaulted by heat or cold. 04:53.566 --> 04:59.177 Most people in the world couldn't fathom such a situation. 05:00.895 --> 05:11.708 I mean, I suppose for Buddhist monks it's made a lot easier because we have this fallback of relying on Buddhist societies to care for us. 05:13.170 --> 05:19.578 We have the inheritance of the Buddha. 05:20.519 --> 05:22.902 The Buddha called it an inheritance. 05:22.922 --> 05:30.852 His fame, his glory, the reverence people showed towards him has fallen over. 05:32.165 --> 05:46.762 But even that being so, being a monk can be quite troublesome in terms of the physical well-being. 05:46.802 --> 06:00.518 Having to sometimes go without food, oftentimes go without shelter, forced to be patient with heat and cold, 06:03.029 --> 06:32.142 mosquitoes and insects and things that crawl and things that bite and so it is really a great training if you live as a monk in the forest or as a monk in the countryside even in a Buddhist country where you might get enough to eat from time to time you still have to put up with a lot and you, not that exactly, you learn 06:35.665 --> 06:40.756 And you broaden your, you open your mind to the idea of having nothing. 06:42.741 --> 06:43.823 The idea of being without. 06:43.923 --> 06:45.406 And it's not so scary actually. 06:46.649 --> 06:53.404 There's a guy who wrote 06:57.451 --> 07:01.135 A guy who wrote in 1984, George Orwell, right? 07:01.255 --> 07:10.365 George Orwell wrote, I think it was him, he wrote about being poor in Paris and London, I think. 07:10.425 --> 07:13.108 It's called Down Note in Paris, London and Paris. 07:13.148 --> 07:14.850 Really interesting book to read. 07:14.890 --> 07:18.074 It's about his times. 07:19.455 --> 07:25.382 He was expecting to get a job and then it fell through and suddenly he found himself without any money. 07:27.050 --> 07:38.245 and having to live off scraps, live with hunger, live with thirst, live with the most base of dwellings. 07:41.069 --> 07:48.119 And he said there's a great freedom that comes from it, because you realize you can't fall any further. 07:49.861 --> 07:53.867 For most people it's great suffering even to think about poverty, but for someone who's poor, 07:56.075 --> 07:58.457 And so there's a reassurance there, because you've nothing to fear. 07:58.817 --> 07:59.978 It can't get much worse. 08:02.060 --> 08:04.563 You've fallen as far as you can fall, is what he says. 08:05.884 --> 08:11.389 And so it's like a person standing on a cliff versus a person standing on the ground. 08:11.429 --> 08:21.718 The person standing on the cliff is afraid of coming in contact with the ground at the bottom of the cliff, but the person on the bottom of the cliff doesn't have anything to fear. 08:23.079 --> 08:24.040 They've already fallen. 08:26.956 --> 08:29.018 Anyway, it's not over. 08:31.481 --> 08:32.102 Work that. 08:33.083 --> 08:39.631 Indeed, it is great suffering for people in the world who are still clinging to sensuality. 08:41.794 --> 08:54.769 And he said in the book, he says, 08:56.268 --> 09:13.091 Basically, for one who is, he uses a bunch of synonyms, but for one who is destitute, helpless, asako, analaho, not even having a measure of rice. 09:15.775 --> 09:23.946 Suppose they come into debt, because they have no money, they have to borrow money. 09:26.170 --> 09:39.808 just to get food, maybe they have to borrow money to get a place to stay, borrow money just to get a bowl in which to eat out of. 09:39.828 --> 09:43.052 Now isn't that great suffering? 09:43.974 --> 09:44.955 Debt, no? 09:46.792 --> 10:08.603 Many people, even if they're not incredibly poor, understand the fear and the anguish that comes from being in debt, the feeling of helplessness, hopelessness, the feeling of slavery, of being in debt. 10:11.548 --> 10:14.672 Well, isn't this also suffering? 10:18.162 --> 10:32.678 And so for one who has a debt, وَدِنْ بَتِسُنَ سُنَّتِ 10:40.268 --> 10:42.151 They have to pay interest on their debt. 10:43.113 --> 10:44.275 Isn't that suffering, right? 10:44.355 --> 10:47.079 Of course, because once you're in debt, it's not just about paying it back. 10:47.881 --> 10:49.764 Sometimes all you can pay back is the interest. 10:51.026 --> 10:52.849 Say, yes, indeed, that's greater suffering. 10:53.870 --> 10:55.052 He's building up to something here. 10:55.072 --> 10:56.895 It's actually not as simple as it sounds. 10:57.036 --> 10:57.737 He's got something. 10:57.777 --> 11:01.483 He's actually using this as a comparison to something. 11:01.463 --> 11:03.047 There's more to this sutta than this. 11:03.228 --> 11:12.351 Although even this, it's a good example of how sensuality can lead you to suffering because we often go into debt. 11:14.660 --> 11:19.727 And we suffer from debt due to our desires, wanting a big car, a big house. 11:20.288 --> 11:25.455 I have a couple of students near Toronto and they were talking to me about this. 11:25.535 --> 11:26.857 I finally went to visit their house. 11:28.780 --> 11:29.941 They might actually be listening. 11:29.981 --> 11:31.103 Probably they are listening now. 11:32.325 --> 11:41.798 And they were explaining to me how they're going to sell this house because before they bought this house when they hadn't meditated yet and like 11:43.617 --> 11:51.889 Many other people, they were caught up in the idea of having a really nice house, and indeed their house is exceptionally nice. 11:52.470 --> 11:53.311 They don't have any children. 11:55.714 --> 11:58.558 So just the two of them in this big, nice, beautiful house. 12:00.181 --> 12:03.005 And then when they started meditating, they realized, you know, what is this? 12:03.826 --> 12:06.329 We're deeply in debt. 12:06.349 --> 12:07.431 And... 12:08.491 --> 12:23.925 So they've decided to sell the house and they're going to buy a house that is more reasonable, that they can still take care of their parents and have their parents move in with them, which is always nice. 12:23.945 --> 12:32.513 But for those who are caught up in it, you see so many people buying these big, luxurious houses and living the rest of their lives in slavery. 12:34.134 --> 12:35.916 Right, so interest. 12:37.195 --> 12:39.659 And for one who has interest, what else happens? 12:41.963 --> 12:49.655 They don't give the interest on time. 12:49.775 --> 12:52.780 Let's read the English, I'm going to mess this up. 12:52.800 --> 12:56.085 It's promised to pay interest, cannot pay it when it falls due. 12:56.125 --> 12:58.609 They reprove him. 12:58.669 --> 13:01.253 Isn't that suffering? 13:01.754 --> 13:02.595 Oh yes. 13:03.520 --> 13:10.787 Have you ever absconded on a debt and had to deal with debt collection agencies? 13:11.670 --> 13:12.754 They are the worst. 13:14.118 --> 13:15.560 This once happened to my family. 13:16.681 --> 13:22.628 Someone in our family had a long-standing debt, student debt from many, many, many years before. 13:23.769 --> 13:26.933 And they were still trying to catch up with this person. 13:28.875 --> 13:32.339 So they would call us and say nasty things to us. 13:33.341 --> 13:36.004 Just anything they could do to make us upset. 13:37.566 --> 13:39.168 Pretty awful. 13:39.188 --> 13:40.429 You have to deal with this as well. 13:41.995 --> 13:43.477 Anyway, isn't that suffering? 13:43.577 --> 13:44.318 Yes, it's suffering. 13:45.921 --> 13:55.395 And when they're not able to pay and they're chastised in this way, if they still don't pay, they prosecute them, right? 13:55.415 --> 13:56.416 They take them to court. 13:57.819 --> 13:59.561 They find a way to make them pay. 14:00.242 --> 14:02.706 Maybe they repossess their possessions. 14:02.726 --> 14:06.872 They do whatever they can, get a court injunction and get them kicked out of their home or whatever. 14:09.805 --> 14:12.209 and after being prosecuted they even put them in prison. 14:13.511 --> 14:23.265 So this is the fate of a debtor, one who has debt. 14:23.285 --> 14:29.455 In and of itself it's a somewhat stinging indictment of sensuality, right? 14:29.475 --> 14:31.859 Because this happens to many people. 14:32.580 --> 14:33.501 It happens to people 14:34.882 --> 14:37.995 Even not living extravagant lifestyles, right? 14:38.637 --> 14:45.786 But it causes suffering when we have attachment to these things, when we've built up a stable life and then this happens to us. 14:46.964 --> 14:48.887 I mean, there's great suffering in losing all that you have. 14:48.927 --> 14:52.292 Not having a home is certainly stressful, especially in a cold climate. 14:52.332 --> 14:53.133 What are you going to do? 14:53.173 --> 14:57.640 Having to go to homeless shelters or worse, live on the street is great suffering. 14:58.641 --> 15:02.206 But it's much worse suffering for one who's attached to those things, right? 15:02.226 --> 15:09.557 It's double suffering because those things had meaning to us, had value to us, because we clung to them. 15:12.562 --> 15:15.486 Much more than just the functional value that they held. 15:17.035 --> 15:25.003 There's more to this sutta, and actually the more wonderful thing about this sutta is that he's only using this as a metaphor, an allegory. 15:29.007 --> 15:35.534 So he says, the Buddha says, suppose you have a person who doesn't have faith. 15:36.675 --> 15:38.076 Let's look at this, what is Pali? 15:40.879 --> 15:43.802 Iti ko bhikkave, even so monk. 15:47.461 --> 15:48.309 Let's see. 15:51.950 --> 16:17.991 A person who doesn't think to keep moral presets, doesn't have any interest in ethics, doesn't have any interest in meditation, has no thought to understand, to cultivate understanding. 16:18.494 --> 16:40.958 has no shame in regards conscientiousness in regards to wholesome dhammas has no fear in regards to not fear exactly but something like that 16:40.938 --> 16:43.883 in regards to wholesome dhammas. 16:43.903 --> 16:48.730 It puts out no effort in regards to wholesome dhammas. 16:49.471 --> 16:51.554 It doesn't work to cultivate wholesomeness. 16:52.776 --> 16:59.407 It has no wisdom in regards to wholesome dhammas. 16:59.427 --> 17:02.111 Basically, it's devoid of any wholesome qualities. 17:02.812 --> 17:07.519 ayam ucyati bhikve aryasavinaye dalido asako analhi 17:10.132 --> 17:20.085 This is called, O monks, in the Vinaya, in the discipline of the noble ones, alias savinaya. 17:20.105 --> 17:22.669 Dalido, this is called a dalit. 17:23.349 --> 17:27.615 So this word that in India they're very familiar with, the dalit. 17:28.456 --> 17:31.620 This is called a dalit in the Buddhist sasana. 17:33.323 --> 17:37.388 Asako, one who has nothing, anarchiko, not even a measure of rice. 17:38.836 --> 18:05.890 doesn't have the smallest bit of anything, it's worthless it's destitute is really the point so remember this is the first one, it's a poor person so that poor destitute person in the Dhamma without any 18:08.789 --> 18:37.429 not having any confidence, not having any shame or dread or energy or wisdom, such a person will will do evil deeds with the body will do evil deeds by speech they will do evil deeds with mind, their mind will have evil thoughts 18:42.488 --> 18:47.638 So it's impoverished as someone who doesn't have wholesome dhammas right off the bat. 18:49.373 --> 18:56.243 But just like a person who's poor, the problem with being poor is you can't afford the things that you want. 18:56.323 --> 18:57.605 You can't afford good things. 18:57.825 --> 18:59.447 You can't afford things that bring happiness. 19:01.090 --> 19:11.685 Even much more so, a person devoid of wholesome qualities has no power to cultivate wholesome mind states, to cultivate mind states that lead to happiness. 19:12.846 --> 19:15.089 Happiness is not something that just falls in your lap. 19:15.150 --> 19:18.334 It doesn't even come just because you have a big house and a big car and 19:20.457 --> 19:23.926 Beautiful clothes, delicious food, it doesn't come from any of that. 19:29.380 --> 19:30.664 Did you guys get chocolate today? 19:32.669 --> 19:33.571 Did you see the chocolate? 19:35.175 --> 19:36.559 It doesn't even come from chocolate. 19:44.673 --> 19:45.814 No, I had some chocolate. 19:45.834 --> 19:48.076 No, I said happiness doesn't come from chocolate. 19:48.256 --> 19:49.017 It was chocolate. 19:49.758 --> 19:54.142 But even chocolate doesn't bring happiness. 19:55.103 --> 19:55.864 It brings pleasure. 19:57.025 --> 19:58.947 Pleasure brings some happiness, it's true. 20:00.809 --> 20:02.690 But that's adulterated happiness. 20:03.091 --> 20:06.294 It's happiness that's associated with desire. 20:08.876 --> 20:10.438 It also makes you kind of edgy. 20:11.078 --> 20:13.701 You have to be careful not to eat too much chocolate as a meditator. 20:17.917 --> 20:24.573 So a person, as a result, they get in debt. 20:25.455 --> 20:30.728 So the debt in the Arya Vinaya is they do evil deeds. 20:32.497 --> 20:36.244 It's not only that they can't do good deeds, but they also do evil deeds. 20:36.264 --> 20:53.357 Because they're devoid of any goodness, they fall prey to their own anger, their own greed, their own delusion, and they hurt others, they hurt themselves, they hate others, they hate themselves, they desire things, they become addicted to things, they have conceit and arrogance. 20:55.261 --> 20:56.383 And this is called debt. 20:57.164 --> 20:58.166 Karma is a debt. 20:58.647 --> 21:00.149 Have you ever heard of the karmic debt? 21:00.910 --> 21:07.742 A person who is in debt in Buddhism is a person who has cultivated unwholesomeness and just waiting to have to pay it back. 21:08.984 --> 21:15.615 And often they'll get into this cycle where they have to keep doing evil deeds just to push back the results. 21:18.194 --> 21:29.097 It's doubling down on their debt by running away from the consequences, finding ways to dig themselves deeper and deeper. 21:29.118 --> 21:32.485 That's how addiction works. 21:32.505 --> 21:38.177 You get addicted to something and then every time you indulge in the addiction you just dig yourself deeper and deeper. 21:39.220 --> 21:40.982 running away from the consequences. 21:42.064 --> 21:51.137 Of course, the same goes with when you hurt others, and then in order to stop them from hurting you back, you keep hurting them, or keep acting in mean and nasty ways to keep them away. 21:53.580 --> 21:54.782 So that's debt. 21:54.802 --> 21:56.504 Debt in the Buddhist teaching is that. 21:57.065 --> 21:59.268 It's the evil karma that we do. 22:01.371 --> 22:08.080 This I call debt. 22:11.350 --> 22:18.479 And doing all those evil deeds, let's see. 22:18.699 --> 22:37.943 They hide their evil deeds. 22:37.963 --> 22:39.265 This is what I was talking about. 22:40.477 --> 22:41.999 They hide their evil deeds. 22:42.600 --> 22:48.690 May this person not, they wish, may people not know what I've done. 22:48.810 --> 23:00.468 They think, they speak words to the effect, or no, they speak the words, may they not know me, may they not know what I've done. 23:01.029 --> 23:03.733 And they hide their, what do they do? 23:05.958 --> 23:08.041 They exert themselves with body. 23:08.081 --> 23:10.784 They do deeds to make sure that no one finds out what they've done. 23:11.725 --> 23:15.270 They speak words so that people, they lie, for example. 23:17.713 --> 23:18.393 What is this called? 23:18.413 --> 23:19.335 This is the interest. 23:20.216 --> 23:22.699 This is compound interest on your loan. 23:26.443 --> 23:27.985 Making it worse, basically. 23:30.168 --> 23:32.691 Maybe it's the interest that you have to pay. 23:36.552 --> 23:46.123 You have to pay interest when you're not able to pay it back until you have the wholesome qualities necessary to stop being such a terrible person. 23:46.984 --> 23:48.947 You pay the interest of having to hide it. 23:56.796 --> 23:57.537 That's number three. 23:57.597 --> 23:58.678 Number four. 23:59.738 --> 24:25.847 well-behaved monks fellow fellow monks let's not just say monks no it's not monks your fellows in the holy life so that's all of you guys fellows it's all of us as a community our fellow holy people fellow spiritual beings fellow religious 24:29.168 --> 24:32.551 They say, what do they say? 24:32.611 --> 24:33.632 Do they say good things? 24:33.793 --> 24:34.073 No. 24:34.453 --> 24:36.095 These are the good people. 24:37.036 --> 24:37.917 The wise ones. 24:38.597 --> 24:42.141 No, sorry, the well-behaved ones. 24:42.501 --> 24:51.330 Thus has this person done. 24:51.370 --> 24:53.352 They've acted in this way. 24:53.392 --> 24:56.695 They've acted in this way. 24:58.295 --> 25:00.398 So they say nasty things about this person. 25:00.458 --> 25:02.321 Not nasty things, they tell the truth about them. 25:02.882 --> 25:07.369 Everyone knows what they've done and the word spreads and who wants to be with such a person? 25:13.017 --> 25:17.063 When you go to meditation centers you become known as the troublemaker. 25:17.964 --> 25:23.813 Now thinking about it in society, as a mean and nasty person, 25:27.607 --> 25:30.731 People spread bad, bad report about you. 25:31.532 --> 25:36.379 This is when you're, how do you use the word, reproved. 25:36.599 --> 25:41.546 You're reproved. 25:41.586 --> 25:47.734 This is just like the people you've borrowed money from reproving you. 25:47.774 --> 25:49.176 Hey, when are you going to pay me back? 25:51.215 --> 25:53.258 person who has done evil deeds gets this. 25:53.578 --> 25:55.580 Hey, when are you going to pay back those evil deeds? 25:55.781 --> 25:58.444 When are you going to stop being such an evil, terrible person? 26:04.111 --> 26:07.535 They don't say it like that, but they're scolded for being such an evil person. 26:07.596 --> 26:08.096 No one likes. 26:09.878 --> 26:14.404 This is one of the reasons for realizing the importance of 26:16.190 --> 26:28.748 True meditation, not just meditation that makes you feel happy, but meditation that helps you become a better person. 26:28.968 --> 26:30.490 That's number, what were we on? 26:32.193 --> 26:32.754 Number four. 26:36.138 --> 26:37.320 Number five. 26:39.106 --> 27:07.341 having gone to the forest, having gone to the root of a tree, having gone to an empty place, they are overcome, they are remorseful, evil, unwholesome, 27:09.937 --> 27:12.623 Thoughts? 27:14.375 --> 27:16.999 Bad and wholesome thoughts accompanied by remorse. 27:17.239 --> 27:17.520 Yes. 27:18.261 --> 27:24.510 It's an interesting use because it shows the Buddha's recognition that feeling remorse is not wholesome. 27:25.751 --> 27:27.474 It's not good that you feel remorse. 27:27.594 --> 27:30.058 It's natural that you feel remorse for doing bad deeds. 27:30.078 --> 27:30.679 But it's not good. 27:31.800 --> 27:37.028 So anyone who sits around feeling guilty about the bad things they've done isn't helping things. 27:37.408 --> 27:38.590 It's not doing any benefit. 27:38.610 --> 27:44.078 And he makes this clear by saying they're akusa lavitaka, papaka, they're evil thoughts. 27:45.442 --> 27:49.026 So this person is so caught up in evil that even the guilt that they feel is evil. 27:50.468 --> 27:53.171 They hate themselves for being such an evil person. 27:54.553 --> 27:56.596 They scold themselves, and that's more evil. 27:57.136 --> 27:58.918 It doesn't actually make you a better person. 28:02.383 --> 28:10.032 You might argue it comes from a knowledge of having, it's better than the opposite, which is feeling good about yourself because you've done evil deeds. 28:12.847 --> 28:15.711 But it's not the right response. 28:16.372 --> 28:17.514 It's a natural response. 28:17.794 --> 28:29.090 Of course, the better response is to start smartening up and working to become a better person and changing your way, realizing that what you've done is wrong and working as a result to change. 28:33.176 --> 28:39.445 It might not even be guilt, but it's fear and, well, yeah, guilt, I guess, it's remorse. 28:40.741 --> 28:41.542 So what do we call this? 28:41.602 --> 28:44.767 This is called being persecuted, prosecuted. 28:49.594 --> 28:51.376 Prosecuted, like the wording, no? 28:51.396 --> 28:53.700 This is like a court, the karmic court. 28:54.080 --> 28:55.602 It's not a person, it's not people. 28:56.203 --> 29:06.078 This is when you're off in the forest alone, that's when the law, you become prosecuted, the law prosecutes you. 29:07.680 --> 29:09.803 You become an outlaw, a karmic outlaw. 29:11.572 --> 29:12.934 living off in the frontier. 29:17.099 --> 29:18.481 But you can't escape karma. 29:18.501 --> 29:20.243 No one can escape their karma. 29:21.225 --> 29:22.987 That's what my old friend Udi used to say. 29:26.531 --> 29:27.673 Yeah, they'd be prosecuted. 29:27.813 --> 29:30.977 And number six, eventually put in jail. 29:31.017 --> 29:33.320 What does it mean to be put in jail in the Buddhist teaching? 29:35.623 --> 29:40.009 So this, this poor, 29:41.305 --> 29:52.279 Remember we're talking about this person in terms of this destitute, impoverished, penniless person having done evil deeds with body, speech and mind. 29:52.339 --> 30:10.283 They become bound or they... 30:11.512 --> 30:18.480 Yes, they become bound, imprisoned by the binds of hell. 30:19.361 --> 30:37.283 At the breakup of the body, after death, nirya bandhaneva bhajati, they become bound by the bonds of hell, tirachanayoni bandhaneva, or the bonds of the animal realm. 30:39.102 --> 30:55.919 Oh, because I don't see a single bind, a single imprisonment. 30:56.880 --> 31:01.544 That is as terrible, harsh, cruel. 31:03.266 --> 31:09.092 That is as painful, severe. 31:10.979 --> 31:24.537 Buddha likes to use, this is a, I've talked about this before, this is a means of teaching, a teaching method, repeating yourself using different words, because remember you're talking to a live audience. 31:25.738 --> 31:28.422 This is meant, this is something that Buddha would have spoken. 31:28.482 --> 31:31.686 And to get the point across, you repeat yourself. 31:31.806 --> 31:33.949 It evokes 31:33.929 --> 31:34.810 feelings. 31:35.330 --> 31:36.371 There's a master at this. 31:36.772 --> 31:41.777 Ewang darunang, ewang katukang, ewang antarayakang. 31:41.797 --> 31:42.698 Antarayakara. 31:44.840 --> 31:45.621 Antaraya. 31:45.681 --> 31:47.483 The most dangerous. 31:52.247 --> 31:55.010 Anuttarasa yoga kemasa adhigamaya. 31:57.713 --> 32:00.115 Yoga kemasa adhigamaya. 32:00.135 --> 32:00.696 What does that mean? 32:01.942 --> 32:06.568 It's such an obstacle for attaining the unsurpassed security from bondage. 32:09.532 --> 32:20.386 It's a danger that creates such a danger, such an obstacle, such a problem for becoming free from suffering. 32:22.589 --> 32:27.375 It's a danger that creates such a danger, such an obstacle, such a problem for becoming free from suffering. 32:30.595 --> 32:38.369 Hell and the animal realms are the worst prison because they make it so impossible to ever become free from suffering. 32:39.932 --> 32:50.511 The concept of an animal even coming to keep five precepts or to have, not just keep them, but to have the thought, the wholesome thought of 32:53.798 --> 33:01.248 wishing well to their fellow beings and refraining from evil purposefully. 33:01.929 --> 33:06.776 It's not just, well, you're born as a cow so you don't eat meat or you don't kill other animals. 33:08.519 --> 33:16.650 It's the refraining from, because even cows will swat their tails at flies, perfectly content to kill the flies if they're able. 33:21.541 --> 33:28.730 very difficult for an animal or even worse, I suppose, for someone born in hell to ever make their way back to the human realm. 33:29.311 --> 33:33.096 It happens, but it doesn't happen a lot more. 33:36.841 --> 33:37.622 So there you have it. 33:37.642 --> 33:38.943 This is a really powerful one. 33:40.025 --> 33:40.485 I like this. 33:40.605 --> 33:42.548 I'm happy to have found it. 33:44.190 --> 33:45.051 Comparing 33:46.094 --> 33:50.726 Our evil deeds with debt, going in debt. 33:50.926 --> 33:59.027 It's a good description of the idea of karmic debt, how bad karma is like incurring a debt. 33:59.088 --> 34:03.158 So there you go, that's our dhamma for this evening. 34:04.859 --> 34:07.844 It's a good motivation for us to practice. 34:08.425 --> 34:10.448 That's what we're doing when we practice meditation. 34:10.508 --> 34:31.423 We're working out these karmic tendencies, the tendency to perform evil deeds, protecting ourselves in this way, paying back our debt in many ways by changing the way we are, changing our minds, giving up greed, giving up anger, giving up delusion. 34:33.698 --> 34:34.900 Only good can come of it. 34:37.826 --> 34:40.491 Freedom from debt. 34:40.511 --> 34:41.854 All right, that's all for tonight. 34:43.837 --> 34:44.739 I have some questions. 34:48.106 --> 34:49.228 Thank you, Bhante. 34:53.456 --> 34:56.702 When saying happy, happy, happy, or sad, 34:57.593 --> 34:59.155 That aren't we judging our feelings? 34:59.876 --> 35:05.283 Is saying feeling, feeling, feeling vague or thick of the feelings? 35:05.744 --> 35:06.024 Thanks. 35:08.968 --> 35:10.950 No, if you feel happy, it's a happy feeling. 35:10.990 --> 35:12.412 You say happy, happy. 35:12.432 --> 35:15.056 Sad, you say sad, sad. 35:15.076 --> 35:17.379 If you were to say good, good, good, that would be judging. 35:18.240 --> 35:19.181 Bad, bad, bad. 35:19.602 --> 35:20.403 That would be judging. 35:21.524 --> 35:24.428 But a happy feeling is distinctly different from an unhappy feeling. 35:26.500 --> 35:27.854 That's subjective. 35:41.823 --> 35:44.006 Bunthe, I have anxiety issues. 35:44.426 --> 35:52.337 There are some days I can regimentally follow meditation schedule and it helps reduce my anxiousness and even meditate more. 35:53.118 --> 35:59.967 But other days I feel so much anxiety in the morning itself about samsara stuff such as my work, school, etc. 36:00.107 --> 36:01.128 that I can't meditate. 36:02.009 --> 36:06.415 So I end up jumping from one thing to another without being mindful and wasting more time. 36:08.438 --> 36:11.121 Be more anxious and not meditate throughout the day. 36:11.624 --> 36:13.229 Why is every morning so different? 36:13.630 --> 36:20.790 How can I make sure I don't skip my first morning meditation in the morning as it seems to have the biggest impact on my day? 36:22.120 --> 36:23.462 Well, impermanence. 36:23.482 --> 36:24.384 You're not in control. 36:25.285 --> 36:28.450 Just because you want it to be the same every morning doesn't mean it's going to be. 36:30.033 --> 36:32.096 Meditation always takes flexibility. 36:32.737 --> 36:35.822 It's one of the things you learn is that you can't expect it to be the same. 36:35.862 --> 36:44.796 You can't rely upon your abilities yesterday to help you through today's meditation. 36:46.118 --> 36:48.702 You have to adapt to today. 36:53.508 --> 36:59.670 I mean, if you only meditated when you weren't anxious, well, you'd never actually learn to deal with the anxiety. 37:04.898 --> 37:10.567 And don't be too hard on yourself either, just because you don't meditate the same amount every day. 37:10.667 --> 37:18.459 I mean, it's good if you can do at least an hour or two a day, but if you're working all day, just try to be mindful throughout the day. 37:18.619 --> 37:25.770 Sometimes you might not be able to do the meditation you want to do, but instead you can be mindful during the day as you're doing your work. 37:26.151 --> 37:28.394 And when you're anxious, why aren't you meditating? 37:28.414 --> 37:30.417 You should say to yourself, anxious, anxious. 37:36.269 --> 37:37.671 You say, I can't meditate. 37:37.731 --> 37:39.214 If you feel anxious, you can't meditate. 37:39.274 --> 37:40.275 Well, what have I taught you? 37:41.377 --> 37:42.459 Haven't I taught you anything? 37:43.480 --> 37:45.263 If you're anxious, meditate on the anxiety. 37:56.019 --> 38:02.850 I've heard that as one becomes more advanced, the duration of one's time in the jhanic states are progressively extended. 38:03.353 --> 38:12.204 Does one who meditates only with vipassana experience this as well, like being able to remain in a jhanic state for a week rather than for an hour? 38:12.244 --> 38:16.409 Or does this extension only occur for samacca jhana? 38:17.630 --> 38:21.475 If such does not occur for vipassana jhana... 38:21.555 --> 38:27.682 I'm sorry, I'm not going to interrupt you, but I guess I'd rather not, because I don't think I'm going to answer this question. 38:28.443 --> 38:30.205 It's a little too... 38:32.294 --> 38:34.116 I don't like obsessing about the jhanas. 38:36.378 --> 38:41.684 I know a lot of teachers do talk about them, but it just gets too technical and too complicated. 38:41.724 --> 38:44.427 It's not what I'd want you to focus on as a meditator. 38:45.368 --> 38:58.002 Focus on the four satipatthana and the three characteristics, learning to see and understand and let go of the things that you cling to by seeing the three characteristics. 38:58.022 --> 38:58.943 Don't worry about the jhanas. 39:01.066 --> 39:04.289 Okay, Bonte, the next two questions are about the jhanas as well. 39:04.309 --> 39:07.373 Should we just skip down to the one that's not about the jhanas? 39:12.038 --> 39:13.519 So okay, the jhanas. 39:15.982 --> 39:17.704 Yeah, I don't want to answer that one. 39:18.244 --> 39:20.947 Not really my cup of tea. 39:21.027 --> 39:22.149 Yeah, neither that one either. 39:22.249 --> 39:26.213 Okay, sorry, we're gonna, I'm sorry, but I'm not gonna answer those. 39:28.184 --> 39:29.225 I'm getting old, you know? 39:29.646 --> 39:31.447 I feel like I'm getting older now. 39:32.168 --> 39:41.057 I'm not as... No, that's not a good excuse, but... You know when you get older and you can start to say those sorts of things? 39:41.117 --> 39:42.119 Oh, I'm too old for this. 39:43.500 --> 39:46.563 I was talking to one of my professors and she used that excuse. 39:46.583 --> 39:49.546 I said, yeah, but don't we use that excuse throughout our lives? 39:51.568 --> 39:57.955 And she said, well, you know, there's got to be something good about getting old if I can't use it as an excuse for my memories. 40:01.934 --> 40:07.280 I'm over here laughing because I'm thinking of your teacher, Bhante, who's, how old is Sanjantong now? 40:07.301 --> 40:08.101 About 94? 40:08.282 --> 40:10.264 And I've never heard him complain about being old. 40:11.185 --> 40:16.852 I know, and I think he would probably smile at you complaining that you're too old to answer questions. 40:17.233 --> 40:18.014 That's right. 40:18.034 --> 40:18.554 But he doesn't. 40:18.814 --> 40:20.777 Oh, you know, you'd never get away with these questions. 40:21.358 --> 40:25.022 All these questions I've been asked, you'd never get away with any of them from him. 40:26.403 --> 40:27.485 He just wouldn't answer them. 40:28.426 --> 40:29.007 He really wouldn't. 40:29.567 --> 40:35.756 No, he'd answer them, but he'd give you an answer that set you back on track. 40:36.758 --> 40:46.251 He was really good at giving answers that didn't actually answer the question, but gave you the answer you needed, or answered it in such a way as to remind you of what you should be asking. 40:49.454 --> 40:49.975 Definitely. 40:49.995 --> 40:51.896 He definitely had that ability. 40:52.157 --> 40:58.583 I remember asking him one time a simple question about whether Nibbana was Rupa or Nama. 41:00.525 --> 41:04.569 And the answer he gave me, wow, it was... 41:04.589 --> 41:06.091 I mean, he didn't even say all that much. 41:06.211 --> 41:07.352 He just said it's Dhamma. 41:08.333 --> 41:09.274 Nibbana is a Dhamma. 41:09.294 --> 41:13.078 But the way he was saying it was like, you want to talk about Nibbana? 41:14.279 --> 41:16.021 Here's a guy who knows about Nibbana. 41:16.922 --> 41:18.263 Anyway, it's... 41:18.243 --> 41:23.612 I know I sound like a fanboy or something, like I'm enamored with him, but you really have to meet him. 41:23.832 --> 41:26.296 It's not, this isn't, I mean I've met lots of people. 41:26.316 --> 41:35.931 I suppose it's true that I've always been kind of giving myself over to teachers, but I've never met anyone else like him. 41:37.008 --> 41:46.316 Well, even as someone who's obviously never met your teacher, I just watched a couple of videos, and of course I couldn't understand what he was saying, but there was a presence. 41:46.356 --> 41:47.758 There was something special. 41:47.778 --> 41:51.741 It was kind of captivating, even though I couldn't actually understand what he was saying. 41:52.101 --> 41:54.223 Clearly a special person. 41:55.925 --> 41:58.407 So don't think that he'd be answering all these questions. 42:01.550 --> 42:05.293 He'd probably shake his head at the fact that I'm even entertaining him with these questions. 42:08.125 --> 42:12.589 He asked me once, are you trying to become a Buddha? 42:12.609 --> 42:16.914 I said, no. 42:16.934 --> 42:18.295 Just crazy Westerners. 42:18.956 --> 42:19.176 Yeah. 42:19.857 --> 42:20.738 No, but I like that question. 42:20.758 --> 42:21.719 Are you trying to become a Buddha? 42:21.739 --> 42:25.322 Basically saying to me, why are you, what are you doing? 42:25.382 --> 42:27.524 Working. 42:29.887 --> 42:31.809 He's very focused. 42:31.829 --> 42:35.112 He's sort of, people would say he's done what he has to do. 42:39.935 --> 42:40.736 Hello, Bhante. 42:41.017 --> 42:50.911 I've been thinking about the Brahma Viharas recently, and I was wondering how does an Arahant view, use, interact with them if an Arahant has transcended good and evil? 42:51.712 --> 42:53.395 Do they still carry moral weight? 42:54.196 --> 42:56.259 Are the Brahma Viharas inherently good? 42:56.619 --> 42:57.100 Thank you. 42:57.147 --> 42:59.250 So the Bhyamaharas are inherently good. 42:59.270 --> 43:01.993 That's interesting. 43:02.034 --> 43:02.975 It's an interesting question. 43:03.075 --> 43:04.016 Are they inherently good? 43:04.036 --> 43:07.120 I mean, in a mundane sense, yes, they are inherently good. 43:07.701 --> 43:11.706 But there's no state that arises that is inherently good. 43:12.487 --> 43:13.869 It arises and it ceases. 43:14.029 --> 43:18.936 So in one sense, you can't say anything is inherently of any value. 43:18.916 --> 43:47.370 but functionally they're of great value in a mundane sense and in terms of helping you become an arahant they're a good thing but what you're asking is something different whether they're any good to the arahant obviously they aren't any good because an arahant doesn't have any good to gain I would say you have to understand the best way to look at an arahant is to understand that they're at that point acting on 43:51.181 --> 43:56.750 acting functionally, acting on, I want to say, almost habit. 43:58.132 --> 44:08.168 And their habits will still change, but the only thing that's missing is any desire, any aversion, any greed, any impulse to change. 44:11.934 --> 44:18.184 It's very difficult to talk about, because they don't seem to have 44:19.210 --> 44:30.368 They won't seem to have lost the impulse to better themselves, but that's only because that impulse was already there and they're simply acting the way they were. 44:31.512 --> 44:51.006 So an Arahant, I think it's arguable that an Arahant would be working to better themselves, but only because that's just the sort of person they are, is always working to, so, I mean, in terms of like learning more about the Buddhist teaching, they might study the Tipitika, continue to study the Tipitika, and you'd say, well, they're an Arahant, why are they doing that? 44:52.707 --> 44:58.850 You could say one way of looking at it is kind of out of habit, but I think it's a little deeper than that. 44:59.071 --> 45:02.785 It's more just out of a sense of what is right. 45:05.093 --> 45:07.817 and it's just the proper thing to do. 45:07.837 --> 45:09.579 It's proper. 45:09.660 --> 45:19.193 And so all our aunts are different because they have a different situation, but they're all the same in terms of doing what is proper, as far as they can tell at that moment. 45:19.974 --> 45:21.016 And they sometimes get it wrong. 45:21.717 --> 45:32.232 They sometimes do things that turn out to be improper, but because they had no intention of harm or greed or so on, it's not an unwholesome thing. 45:34.355 --> 45:35.257 It's a good question. 45:35.337 --> 45:37.322 Those kind of questions are reasonable. 45:42.435 --> 45:46.605 Are some of the Brahma Viharas considered to be harder than others? 45:46.625 --> 45:50.254 I have this idea that, like, 45:50.521 --> 45:54.847 upeka would be more difficult than mudita or karuna. 45:54.867 --> 45:59.073 Is that just a perception or is that kind of commonly understood? 45:59.394 --> 46:17.760 No, it's not commonly understood, but you could argue based on the way it's used that upeka might be more difficult in terms of in the sense that it's sort of overarching, but right, because you sort of use you need upeka for the other ones or 46:19.900 --> 46:20.583 I don't know. 46:20.603 --> 46:21.407 No, it's conjecture. 46:21.748 --> 46:25.827 There's certainly nothing that I've ever read, and I'm pretty sure there wouldn't be. 46:27.359 --> 46:31.564 If it's not in the Visuddhi Manga, no, there's no way. 46:32.365 --> 46:32.986 That sort of thing. 46:33.006 --> 46:36.910 I mean, you see very little of that sort of thing where this is more difficult than that. 46:37.451 --> 46:38.091 There's no... 46:39.053 --> 46:42.016 So it's all speculation at that point. 46:42.056 --> 46:44.038 Like there may actually be a truth to that. 46:44.098 --> 46:49.224 The human beings might be more hardwired or something. 46:49.405 --> 46:52.388 You know, there might be something about metta that makes it easier, but 46:54.089 --> 46:56.775 There's no interest, I suppose, in those types of questions. 46:56.995 --> 47:00.863 I mean, there's not anything that's significantly more difficult about one than the other. 47:01.825 --> 47:07.377 Some people might find one more difficult than the other because they have different nuances. 47:07.517 --> 47:10.022 Like Karna and Meta are very similar. 47:11.504 --> 47:19.715 Metta is the impulse to bring happiness to others or help them keep their happiness. 47:21.638 --> 47:24.261 Karuna is to help people avoid suffering. 47:25.323 --> 47:27.485 But what's really the difference? 47:27.505 --> 47:32.432 It's still wishing well or having good wishes towards others. 47:33.627 --> 47:44.744 Well, it is, but in my perception, sympathy is easier because that's almost a natural feeling, whereas mudita, sometimes you have to really not be jealous. 47:45.085 --> 47:51.234 Sometimes the first instinct is jealousy, and then you have to get over that before you can feel mudita for someone else. 47:52.456 --> 47:53.898 But maybe it's just perception. 47:54.800 --> 47:55.861 No, it's a good point. 47:55.881 --> 47:59.567 It's different, and I think a lot of us have that problem. 48:00.897 --> 48:07.563 On the other hand, we might miss some of the, I mean, no, on the other hand we get angry at people, which means we don't have metta towards them. 48:09.305 --> 48:16.151 And I think we are, you know, if you think of it in terms of when you actually sit down to practice it, they're pretty much the same. 48:17.092 --> 48:27.242 You know, you have to overcome that natural inclination to hate the fact that other people are doing better than you, or you have to get over the natural inclination to dislike someone. 48:27.222 --> 48:57.145 like metta isn't you know it's uh right so metta when well when when aimed at those people who you're different towards or even those people you hate it's difficult either way mudita it takes a bit to get over that jealousy but then it can be quite easy once you get into it thank you pate 48:57.293 --> 49:00.978 I suppose some people are more prone to jealousy than others as well. 49:02.000 --> 49:03.542 Some people are just prone to hatred. 49:04.082 --> 49:05.565 There are some people who don't like others. 49:08.929 --> 49:10.712 As I said, it's probably more like... 49:12.795 --> 49:18.983 But upeka seems to me to be the most potential for difficulty. 49:19.404 --> 49:20.946 It's a little more sublime. 49:21.767 --> 49:25.933 Upeka in terms of the Brahmaviharas is actually not having any 49:27.314 --> 49:31.241 not wavering over the suffering of others. 49:32.383 --> 49:37.812 So we talk about karuna in terms of feeling upset when other people are sad, but that's not karuna. 49:41.138 --> 49:45.425 Karuna is not getting sad when other people are sad, and upeka is what stops that. 49:45.466 --> 49:51.516 Upeka is the work to stop you from... 49:53.352 --> 49:56.377 being moved by other people's suffering. 49:56.417 --> 50:00.123 Or not moved, but from being upset by other people's suffering. 50:00.143 --> 50:03.729 And from being partial to one over another. 50:03.890 --> 50:06.774 And that seems to me to be especially difficult. 50:08.457 --> 50:10.821 Because we're inclined towards partiality. 50:22.580 --> 50:22.981 Hello. 50:23.021 --> 50:28.473 Detecting or observing emotions, such as anger, without reacting during my day. 50:28.493 --> 50:38.715 I observe thoughts that provoke emotional reactions without reaction during my sleep, but throughout the day I find it difficult, especially when dealing with family members. 50:42.087 --> 51:04.112 well formal meditation will help with your daily life but there's nothing better than actually working on it you know trying to make an effort making an effort to be mindful during the day when your emotions come up why don't why can't you say to yourself angry and work at it 51:06.100 --> 51:07.221 It can take years. 51:07.281 --> 51:14.749 I mean, the best way to start meditating is to come and do or go somewhere and do an intensive course. 51:14.829 --> 51:17.032 So if you have time, take the time to do a few weeks. 51:19.214 --> 51:20.495 Your head is on fire. 51:22.057 --> 51:23.158 Take the time to put it out. 51:24.700 --> 51:25.701 Take three weeks out. 51:25.881 --> 51:27.543 Quit your job if you have to. 51:27.563 --> 51:30.406 Find a way to do three weeks of meditation and change your life. 51:30.526 --> 51:34.470 And then you can go back and have a foundation. 51:36.003 --> 51:37.967 You might even be enlightened by that time. 51:46.041 --> 51:49.207 Barring that, work at it, be patient with it. 51:50.429 --> 51:51.732 No one said it's going to be easy. 51:51.772 --> 51:57.943 If you were thinking that it would be easier, if you're trying to find a way for it to be easy, 51:59.054 --> 51:59.835 It's not easy. 52:00.896 --> 52:02.278 That's something you have to realize. 52:02.298 --> 52:03.620 And it's not meant to be easy. 52:03.640 --> 52:04.801 It's meant to be challenging. 52:04.862 --> 52:06.684 It's meant to challenge you, to change you. 52:09.427 --> 52:11.290 We were born because of defilements. 52:12.051 --> 52:18.379 So the whole essence of what it means to be human is based on defilements. 52:19.675 --> 52:48.990 to be born in any realm we're only born because of our bad things so who we are is a bundle of attachments working to free ourselves from that is not easy especially in regards to the problem with dealing with family members is that they're so close we cling so strongly to them it's more difficult 52:59.669 --> 53:05.797 I don't know why you're breaking up. 53:06.218 --> 53:07.720 You shouldn't be breaking up. 53:07.740 --> 53:13.908 The internet's gotten a lot worse, I think. 53:13.948 --> 53:19.996 I don't know if it's on my end or your end, but yeah, we've had a lot of problems. 53:22.299 --> 53:25.624 I think that's why we're having problems with the audio broadcast as well. 53:26.765 --> 53:29.389 We're having some problems with the video broadcast. 53:30.382 --> 53:36.029 You know what I was thinking I wanted to talk about. 53:36.049 --> 53:48.565 I was wondering if we wanted to look at the idea of setting up a virtual reality world like Second Life where we were all sitting around together. 53:50.407 --> 53:50.747 Hear me out. 53:50.767 --> 53:54.432 There's one good thing about it is that it's a really good 53:55.947 --> 53:59.042 conversation. 53:59.062 --> 54:01.333 I mean, it's good for dialogue. 54:02.393 --> 54:07.678 because it provides spatial audio and it provides interactive audio. 54:07.718 --> 54:14.043 So everyone in the virtual reality, I mean, you can see where people are. 54:14.124 --> 54:24.653 So you get a sense of how many people, I mean, it's not just the illusion of being in the space, although that is interesting, but the illusion of being in the space helps to organize, you know? 54:24.673 --> 54:32.400 So like what we're dealing with now is a page that makes it very hard to visualize that these are actual people, right? 54:32.380 --> 54:36.586 I mean, this is more artificial than an artificial reality. 54:36.626 --> 54:44.699 I mean, the comfort of being in something that's similar to what would really be a room full of people is actually useful. 54:45.039 --> 54:50.868 And you can feel it when you get on Second Life and sit with a bunch of people in a deer park. 54:52.250 --> 54:55.996 And they say, okay, you've got a question over here, a question over there. 54:56.577 --> 54:58.219 And they can actually talk to you as well. 54:59.903 --> 55:02.767 We could set something like that up, or we could just use Second Life. 55:03.888 --> 55:07.654 We could use the Buddha Center they have there. 55:07.674 --> 55:09.096 Maybe something to think about. 55:09.136 --> 55:12.220 Yeah, that's interesting. 55:13.902 --> 55:18.789 Are you thinking of doing that during this time instead of this? 55:18.949 --> 55:19.650 Yeah, I was thinking. 55:19.670 --> 55:20.231 That'd be cool. 55:20.311 --> 55:20.511 Yeah. 55:22.330 --> 55:26.399 We have to think of whether we wanted to use the Buddha Center or we could create our own. 55:26.780 --> 55:36.340 One thing about creating our own thing, and I was debating this, is people could have their own spaces because it's free. 55:37.262 --> 55:38.284 It's just the server. 55:38.324 --> 55:39.647 We'd have to pay for the server. 55:40.859 --> 55:48.507 So we could use the Amazon server for $50 a month that the organization is spending for nothing right now. 55:50.049 --> 55:50.550 Or whatever. 55:51.230 --> 55:54.774 I don't think it takes much CPU on the server side. 55:56.837 --> 55:58.138 But people could have their own spaces. 55:58.178 --> 56:05.887 So our members could set up their own little huts or something where they could have a Dhamma world. 56:05.927 --> 56:08.149 We could have a Dhamma community. 56:09.378 --> 56:14.002 And it sounds kind of ridiculous when you get that far, and it seems like it would waste a lot of time. 56:14.563 --> 56:27.074 So I was debating whether you could consider that as useful, because it puts people to using their time to set up like a shrine, basically. 56:27.975 --> 56:34.841 An online shrine, and they could have their kuti with a poster of Ajahn Tong or something, you know? 56:34.861 --> 56:39.385 And they could have a bookshelf, they have a Buddha statue. 56:39.365 --> 56:44.487 and the sense of community it would create, I think would be interesting. 56:46.978 --> 56:49.408 There's nothing, it's all conventional. 56:49.793 --> 56:58.710 Having a real kuti is no more real than having, I mean, it's only in terms of quantity, not quality. 56:58.730 --> 57:02.297 I mean, it's not categorically different than having a virtual reality kuti. 57:03.559 --> 57:04.461 They're both conventional. 57:04.481 --> 57:05.242 They're both not real. 57:05.462 --> 57:07.226 Real is just experiences, right? 57:07.246 --> 57:09.490 So whether you experience a virtual kuti, 57:11.360 --> 57:13.102 I don't know if I'm getting too far off there. 57:13.943 --> 57:17.087 But it's something interesting to think about because we've got this online community. 57:17.107 --> 57:18.449 I don't think this is going to change. 57:19.471 --> 57:21.013 Not in the near future. 57:21.033 --> 57:30.585 I don't think in the near future we're going to have a local community because too many of our community are stuck where they are. 57:32.027 --> 57:37.614 So the idea of creating something, I don't know. 57:39.557 --> 57:40.658 Tell me what you think of that. 57:41.836 --> 57:44.420 No, I think it's great. 57:44.500 --> 57:52.773 I spent a lot of time in virtual reality, part in video games, and that part of my life is gone, but I still love virtual reality. 57:53.214 --> 57:57.301 The only thing I wonder is, are this a second life? 57:58.362 --> 58:04.452 Are they considered difficult for some people to get on? 58:05.174 --> 58:06.357 I think it's easier now. 58:06.377 --> 58:09.384 I mean before the problem was you needed a good computer. 58:10.186 --> 58:15.158 But I think now most computers have the requirements. 58:15.519 --> 58:15.900 I don't know. 58:16.842 --> 58:23.318 I'm assuming that at this point the requirements aren't so hard, so harsh. 58:24.395 --> 58:25.977 So that would be awesome then. 58:26.078 --> 58:32.407 You know, the only unfortunate thing would be if some members of our community weren't able to access it for some reason. 58:32.427 --> 58:33.989 We wouldn't have to rely upon it. 58:35.752 --> 58:50.554 You know, we might, I don't know, that might be something to think about how that would relate because YouTube's, of course, still a great platform, even just in terms of letting people know that we're here. 58:52.475 --> 58:58.008 So potentially, you know, holding the session in Second Life but broadcasting it on YouTube? 58:58.649 --> 58:59.351 Could be done. 59:00.353 --> 59:02.177 That would be a screen share. 59:02.338 --> 59:04.423 And I can do that with this OBS software. 59:05.124 --> 59:05.285 Yeah. 59:05.746 --> 59:06.006 Yeah. 59:07.730 --> 59:08.492 Pretty useful. 59:09.113 --> 59:21.450 You know, we have a couple of people that frequent the Dhamma talks that already have things set up in Second Life, and I'm sure they would invite us. 59:22.271 --> 59:31.524 I don't know if there's anyone in the community who would be willing to look at some of the technical aspects. 59:31.785 --> 59:32.826 I've done it before. 59:32.806 --> 59:37.171 You need to know, oh, it's not even that difficult. 59:37.191 --> 59:44.178 I mean, you just need to be the sort of person who can work with configuration files mainly. 59:44.899 --> 59:59.674 There's a little bit of working on IP addresses and the technicalities of that, but it's mostly working through the configuration files to set it up and just basic knowledge of how to use a bash shell. 59:59.654 --> 01:00:10.879 If there's anybody out there who wants to help set that up, or maybe our IT team could, if anyone wants to join the IT team and be interested, because the back end's a bit of a... 01:00:11.939 --> 01:00:16.309 It's a task to get it all set up and running. 01:00:17.412 --> 01:00:19.176 And then getting voice working. 01:00:21.481 --> 01:00:27.535 We can get a license to use the Vivox servers or something. 01:00:27.595 --> 01:00:29.880 I don't know how it all works. 01:00:29.860 --> 01:00:32.705 Never done that part, but apparently you can get voice. 01:00:33.686 --> 01:00:40.758 So we'd have our own server and we can set up this vast landscape that people could build on. 01:00:41.519 --> 01:00:45.767 They upload their own images and make shapes and stuff. 01:00:49.393 --> 01:00:53.860 So that would be better than just using the standard Second Life platform? 01:00:54.886 --> 01:01:13.651 The Second Life platform would require us to either pay an exorbitant amount of money to get our own space, or use a space that someone else has already made, which isn't a bad idea, because we wouldn't be using it all the time, but there are limitations there. 01:01:15.293 --> 01:01:17.316 It means you get 01:01:19.000 --> 01:01:19.461 Yeah. 01:01:20.302 --> 01:01:21.404 Another good side and bad side. 01:01:21.424 --> 01:01:26.551 The good side is it's already there and you get a large community. 01:01:26.592 --> 01:01:28.735 I think there's a limit to the number of people. 01:01:28.835 --> 01:01:32.521 So you get 20 people, which is actually far fewer than we have right now. 01:01:33.803 --> 01:01:38.089 Although I don't know that we'd get many more actually showing up in a virtual reality world. 01:01:39.841 --> 01:02:06.675 Particularly if you were if you were simulcasting it or whatever, you know to YouTube so then You know people that weren't interested in Being in in person so to speak could still watch it on YouTube so maybe we can do a two-stage thing we can try using second life and and then in the meantime work on setting up our own place potentially if that seemed to be somehow useful beneficial 01:02:08.697 --> 01:02:14.423 The Second Life is free if we're, you know, they need donations to keep it running. 01:02:15.324 --> 01:02:26.156 So people wanted to, I mean, they'd be very happy to have me back because I tend to bring people in and it helps them with donations and that kind of thing. 01:02:26.716 --> 01:02:31.742 And then we'd have to look at their schedule because they'd have to be open at this time every night. 01:02:32.803 --> 01:02:36.527 We'd have to ask for this slot every night, which may not be open anymore. 01:02:41.080 --> 01:02:42.501 All right, well, I can look into that. 01:02:46.645 --> 01:02:47.266 Because it's nice. 01:02:47.446 --> 01:03:03.240 It's nice to, even just using Second Life, it's nice to have that, the people voice questions and a little bit more of a community of the chat is there. 01:03:04.221 --> 01:03:05.282 But we could also take questions. 01:03:05.302 --> 01:03:07.744 I mean, the question then would be, what do we do with this platform? 01:03:07.784 --> 01:03:10.767 And I don't think our website would have to go to waste 01:03:13.193 --> 01:03:16.258 we can still answer the questions on this platform. 01:03:16.278 --> 01:03:18.622 And our meditation, of course, will still be logged here. 01:03:23.110 --> 01:03:23.771 Yeah, definitely. 01:03:24.091 --> 01:03:27.657 The chat and the meditation features are awesome. 01:03:27.677 --> 01:03:28.940 It's the core of our community. 01:03:30.462 --> 01:03:33.187 Yeah. 01:03:33.207 --> 01:03:35.691 Let's see what the people are saying about Second Life. 01:03:46.927 --> 01:03:48.148 peanut galleries, right? 01:03:56.096 --> 01:04:03.824 In the meantime, one more question already just like my talk is that maybe someone doesn't like second life. 01:04:05.205 --> 01:04:07.588 In the meantime, few more questions popped up. 01:04:07.668 --> 01:04:10.411 Would you like to hold those over till tomorrow? 01:04:11.332 --> 01:04:11.652 Okay. 01:04:15.901 --> 01:04:36.880 can we mention our good news oh yeah yeah for sure we should go ahead oh um surimangalo international buddhist meditation society which has been um for a long time you know was a casual group and then it was a provincial non-profit 01:04:37.552 --> 01:04:42.798 finally received the status of being a federal charity in Canada. 01:04:43.800 --> 01:04:56.815 So it's just a good thing people in Canada who contribute to a charity can deduct those donations from their tax returns and so forth, and it makes us more official. 01:04:56.835 --> 01:04:59.558 So that's kind of a cool thing. 01:05:00.480 --> 01:05:06.647 One of our volunteers worked very hard on putting together an awesome application, and it was accepted and we're now official. 01:05:28.261 --> 01:05:29.183 We are now official. 01:05:34.337 --> 01:05:36.242 And we're done for tonight. 01:05:36.262 --> 01:05:36.884 We are. 01:05:37.345 --> 01:05:38.448 Thanks, Robin, for your help. 01:05:39.872 --> 01:05:40.754 Thank you, Bonte. 01:05:41.737 --> 01:05:42.118 Good night.